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Leaders - Mono with Fluro Leader/Braid with Mono Leader etc


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ok, I'm a little confused or maybe a little inexperienced to the rest of you.

 

And by 'you' I mean the experts and full pledged fisherman with knowledge 'second to none' offering the best advice one can get :clap:

 

ok, enough of the bs :facepalm:

 

Leaders........what really is better or best, depending on situation of course.

 

I am landbased, off the beach and jetty.

 

I currently run mono line (lets say 9kg) and have usually just run a 'leader' with the same mono line strength with hooks/sinker, or float/hook or lure (all separated with a swivel.

 

And until this year I didn't know about a 'leader' (although I was using one).

 

Now I read some use as a main line the mono but have fluorocarbon as a leader.

 

I also read that the leader is usually a high strength than the main line (right or wrong).

 

So what's better or best for the following? (and I'm just 'throwing' in strengths for the below)

 

Salmon....main line braid (15kg) with mono leader (25kg)

 

Gar/YFW/tommies/Mullet etc.....main line mono (6kg) with mono leader (2kg)

 

(so just looking at general beach and jetty fish)

 

Where does fluorocarbon line come into it?  Is it really necessary?

 

And...I see in stores you can buy specific leader lines....why?  Can't you use other line you might have or are these 'specific' leaders special in some way or are they just a gimmick for the uneducated (like me).

 

Any advice to get my head around this is appreciated.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Fluorocarbon is meant to be invisible underwater, it is more abarasion reistant than standard mono and has less memory so you feel bites better. Those are the reasons people use it. Is it necessary, 100% no in my opinion, you see the older guys on jetties with buckets full of fish and they are using the same gear 30 years ago. It isn't going to harm your chances though. If you were targetting finicky species such as Bream then I would highly recommend it as they can easily be turned off but a predator species like a Salmon wouldn't worry about using it.

 

I also read that the leader is usually a high strength than the main line (right or wrong).

Yes that is generally the case,

For bream I use  4lb line  with 4lb-8lb leader.

For whiting i use 6lb line with 10lb leader

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You use a leader when you want your line nearest to the fish to have a different character to your main line.

 

Specialist leader lines are made and usually much more expensive because they use different and more complicated and costly processes to produce it so it has specialist characteristics such as suppleness, abrasion resistance, refraction index, floating, sinking, knot strength, etc, etc.

 

Carp anglers in the UK even use special braided line leaders that sink flat to the bottom of the lake and are camouflaged against the muck and lead lines so there is no line poking up that the fish might bump into.

 

Fluorocarbon is often used because its refraction index is closer to water and its usually more abrasion resistant which is ideal in some situations.

 

But there are lots of situations where that's not the case. And its often a matter of personal taste. I like my leaders fairly supple for instance without much memory but that usually implies a trade off with its abrasion resistance.

 

Often you would have a heavier leader than your mainline not for strength but for abrasion and shock resistance at the end where the fish is, stopping it from busting you off by chaffing, chomping on the line or rubbing it against stuff on the bottom/structure. And when fishing braid its often critically important to have a leader with some 'stretch' to avoid pulling hooks.

 

Sometimes you will use lighter than your mainline if you are needing to downsize your leader for spooky/finicky fish.

 

In fly fishing there is the leader which is the part of the line between your fly line and your fly but you often have a 'tippet' on the end of your leader, and with fly fishing to turn over the fly the leader actually steps down getting thinner towards the fly end so the end of your leader is usually your weakest link. Sometimes when you have a toothy fish you will step down your leader and then step up again with a 'bite tippet' of much thicker material or wire.

 

So there is no real rule that the leader must be stronger than your mainline but in most fishing situations that's actually why you want a leader in the first place, an extra strong bit of line at the business end where its going to suffer the most chaffing/abrasion.

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This year I will be putting fluro carbon againtst mono leader to test in a practical sense.  As of today I haven't seen any major benefit when running fluro as opposed to mono in the fishing that I do.  The only benefit I have seen is to external parties ie, more cash in the pocket of the tackle shop.

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See, I knew you were all experts :)

 

But thanks for your input to my query.  It has made my mind a bit clearer with your great explainations.

 

I will put some of that information into use very shortly.

 

I intend to buy a new rod about 7' with very light tip to pursue YFW off the beach this summer and try the suggestions you have made about leaders.

 

I'm feeling more confident already :)

 

Thanks again.

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I'm only a relative novice, but I noticed an increase in sensitivity & hookups and a big decrease in line coil problems etc when I moved from my first cheapie rod with mono to a slightly better setup running braid, with a few extra bucks dropped for some fluorocarbon leader (this is just going for small shore-based species). As for line weight of leader vs main line etc, I agree with pretty much everything Scissors and sbarnden have said. I also find that using a slightly better grade of swivel allows everything to move freely gives me less hassles, too. Cheap crappy brass ones jam up after a use or two, and you get lots of annoying line twist.

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In fact Anaconda have some braid on special for ET and Mojiko (maybe not the 'better' brands, but for the price might give them a go.)

And as BCF is 50mts from them I check them too for both braid and fluro - just don't want to spend too much because it all gets expensivewhen buying brand names.

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So what's better or best for the following? (and I'm just 'throwing' in strengths for the below)

 

Gar/YFW/tommies/Mullet etc.....main line mono (6kg) with mono leader (2kg)

 

(so just looking at general beach and jetty fish)

 

 

Hi doobie.

I'd lighten up that main line mono a bit to 4lb-8lb (approx. 2-4kg) for those species listed. If you prefer to stay with mono then run it straight through, ie your main line is your leader all the way through. The less knots, swivels, attachments and weight the better, in my opinion. My preference is to run braid (4-8lb) to flouro (at the same or slightly higher line strength) attached by a double uni knot on my set ups for species you listed and others such as Bream and Flathead.

Good luck.

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Probably a matter of definitions but my rough interpretation (as it applies to the way i fish): 'leader' when its attached to braid mainline for lure casting; 'trace' for rigs in bait scenarios, for either braid of mono mainlines. Otherwise its the same material, fluoro or mono.

 

Leader is used on braided main lines for shock absorption, abrasion resistance, 'invisability' ect, as mentioned above. Kinda the same when its part of a rig but shock absorbtion doesn't apply with mono mainline.

 

I generally use a FG knot for leader (mono or flouro) to braided mainline.

 

For a bait setup, (braid or mono mainline) i tie the mainline to a swivel and then attach the rig (trace). There are a few exceptions, such as a running rig, where the sinker runs on the mainline before the swivel or other tackle. Only for mono mainline tho as 'running' on braid kills it due to abrasion.

 

Agree with the Pirate that you could certainly lighten up a bit ( :rolleyes: ), but it is a matter of personal preference.

 

For 'small stuff' generally have two setups: 6/8lb braid with 8/12lb flouro via a FG knot. Maybe a bit heavier leader if chasing something like snook or flathead.

 

For shore based lure casting for salmon, 15lb braid with 20lb mono leader.

 

As with any technical stuff  there is a hell of a lot of marketing BS with all fishing gear, including leader lines: Really tho you just need to decide weather to go supple or stiff, ect. I prefer supple for light lure casting, stiffer for salmon casting and stiff for most rigs (esp patternosters as it helps the hooks stick out perpendicular to the rest of the rig)

 

Apply some critical thinking (or bring a strainer) to filter out the BS, patronise a local tackle shop where someone might be able to explain things to you, then find something you are comfortable spending the $ on and experiment!

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So what's better or best for the following? (and I'm just 'throwing' in strengths for the below)

 

Gar/YFW/tommies/Mullet etc.....main line mono (6kg) with mono leader (2kg)

 

(so just looking at general beach and jetty fish)

 

 

Hi doobie.

I'd lighten up that main line mono a bit to 4lb-8lb (approx. 2-4kg) for those species listed. If you prefer to stay with mono then run it straight through, ie your main line is your leader all the way through. The less knots, swivels, attachments and weight the better, in my opinion. My preference is to run braid (4-8lb) to flouro (at the same or slightly higher line strength) attached by a double uni knot on my set ups for species you listed and others such as Bream and Flathead.

Good luck.

 

 

Yeah I agree, I had really just thrown numbers in as I wasn't sure what would generally be the better weight.

But will keep it lighter as you have suggested also.

Thanks.

You can even run fluorocarbon straight through, FC Rock and Berkley Vanish are suitable for this....particularly good if fishing unweighted.

 

Funny as I only just looked at a youtube video showing just that.  And also, nearly purchased the Berkley Vanish from Big W (6lb) for $10 (but didn't.)

 

If a leader is not attached by a swivel but say a blood knot or uni knot, would there be more possible line twist?

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I generally use a FG knot for leader (mono or flouro) to braided mainline.

 

For a bait setup, (braid or mono mainline) i tie the mainline to a swivel and then attach the rig (trace). There are a few exceptions, such as a running rig, where the sinker runs on the mainline before the swivel or other tackle. Only for mono mainline tho as 'running' on braid kills it due to abrasion.

 

For 'small stuff' generally have two setups: 6/8lb braid with 8/12lb flouro via a FG knot. Maybe a bit heavier leader if chasing something like snook or flathead.

 

For shore based lure casting for salmon, 15lb braid with 20lb mono leader.

 

 

Thanks UP.

 

I reckon I have the luring (say for Salmon) ok now - I actually have 20lb braid (could be 15lb as you say) and a metre of 30lb mono leader (separated by swivel).

 

For the smaller stuff (YFW/FH/Gar etc) I'll use around 6lb mono (just because cheaper than braid) and 8lb fluro.

 

The 'knot' (whether it be a FG or Uni etc) has me intrigued, purely because I'm thinking line twist.  Surely having a swivel would greatly reduce line twist compared to one straight line with a knot.

Or, does this really not matter due to casting and sitting for a bite compared casting a lure and retrieval over and over again.

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I reckon I have the luring (say for Salmon) ok now - I actually have 20lb braid (could be 15lb as you say) and a metre of 30lb mono leader (separated by swivel).

 

For the smaller stuff (YFW/FH/Gar etc) I'll use around 6lb mono (just because cheaper than braid) and 8lb fluro.

 

The 'knot' (whether it be a FG or Uni etc) has me intrigued, purely because I'm thinking line twist.  Surely having a swivel would greatly reduce line twist compared to one straight line with a knot.

Or, does this really not matter due to casting and sitting for a bite compared casting a lure and retrieval over and over again.

 

 

 

Yes line twist can be a problem, mainly when casting metals tho. In this case i use a use a quality snap swivel ( currently Black Magic rolling snap swivels)at the business end. No line twists and quick lure changes.

 

HP & SPs the action of most lure/technique combinations doesn't lead to twists in the line. I either tie the leader directly or use a lure snap.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Normally the leader will tend to be slightly heavier than the main line, I run 15lb braid on one of my reels and typically topshot with 20lb mono or fluorocarbon (Topshotting is putting roughly 10-100m of line onto a reel using braid, This can also be called a shock leader or just a leader, although the term leader can often get confused with a regular leader such as the one running from your swivel down to the hook or lure)


As far as the line strengths you've listed I find some of them to be a bit heavy for my liking, For salmon you could drop down as low as 10lb as long as you're fishing in a relatively snag free area although off the jetty you may want to up this to around 20lb depending on the size of the salmon you're targetting, Not sure what part of the state you're from but typically the salmon encountered around jetties in the spencer and st vincent gulfs will be around the 1-2kg range with some larger specimens about, if you went to the west coast where 5-6kg salmon are common though the 30lb mainline would be the go off a jetty.

Gar and tommies you don't need to go overly heavy or overly light in my opinion, the lighter line will help you get longer distances with the light weights that you get from pencil floats and the like but I typically fish using a berley float so I have the float loaded up with berley so its more like casting a sinker for me, My typical go to reel is spooled with 15lb braid and 20lb mono and find this is ample for almost every bread and butter species ranging from gar and tommies through to squid, whiting, salmon and even small rays. I've landed a roughly 15kg ray using this line set up

Fluorocarbon is the better leader line by far but its not entirely necessary, From memory in an email I read about the differences of mono vs fluorocarbon fluorocarbon has a few advantages over mono

Fluorocarbon lets more uv spectrum go through the line compared to mono which does make it near invisible under water, this isn't a very huge advantage as its made out to be as regular mono itself is still quite hard to see underwater and typically fish will be able to see your hook anyway. In saying that though it does make a difference for when the fish are quite shy and skittish but if the fish are in a feeding mode they won't bother as much as long as you use the correct lb line for what you're targeting. (What I mean by this is the suppleness and diametre of the line you're using, For example using 50lb line to make a whiting rig compared to using something like 10-15lb)

Fluorocarbon has a much higher abrasion resistance over mono, Don't get me wrong mono is still quite resistant to abrasion but fluorocarbon has a definite advantage over mono in this aspect. You'll want either of the two lines to use a topshot on braided lines when fishing around structure as braid has near zero abrasion resistance and its possible to snap something as tough as 50lb braid if it hits something like a rock when under pressure.

 

Mono line can actually absorb water whereas fluorocarbon typically doesn't, The more water the mono absorbs the less force it will require to break it, Don't be disheartened by that though as most people still use mono mainline with no troubles.

I'll find a few links for you that can explain the difference between the two better for you, I'll also dig up that email

http://www.berkley-fishing.com/Berkley-ae-monofilament-vs-fluorocarbon-infographic.html

Heres the link the email gave me
http://teachmesurffishing.com/product-review/fluorocarbon-surf-fishing-leaders-vs-monofilament/

All in all as far as mono vs fluorocarbon goes
Yes - There is a definite advantage between the two
No - It is not entirely necessary I've gotten away just using mono leaders more times than I can count but I can feel the advantages when using fluorocarbon

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Great detailed infomation Luke - thanks for taking the time to explain your knowledge.

 

The links also have great information and I have certainly gained more knowledge as a result - which is the ultimate from this site and members.

 

I certainly have been swayed to used to fluoro, and at this stage as a leader.  So far I have recently tested it with a small session at Christies - no real catches of big fish but constant bites and release catches - now whether I would have had the same strike with mono, I wont know, but I feel the fluoro probably did its  job.

 

Only yesterday I removed mono leaders from 3 rods and replaced them with fluoro leaders - mainly leaders for yfw and gar ( and when salmon become more prevalent next year, there will be a fluoro leader for them as well.)  For salmon I now prefer braid over mono purely for some extra casting distance when needed.

 

I'll be trying it all out tomorrow, so will be interesting how I go compared to weeks gone by using all mono.

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  • 1 year later...

Hi everyone. I am wondering what I would need to connect 15Ib mono main line to 6Ib Fluoro leader? Is line to line (Palomar knot) the best or should I join the 2 with a swivel? I have a 12 foot rod and reel where the line was already spooled and I am not too keen to have to take it off. Brisbane river mouth (northern side) is where I am going. I want to keep the 15Ib main line on as I intend to do some surf fishing too.

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I just use a swivel when joining the main line to a leader as with my knot tying for line to line may not be the best :rolleyes:

 

I always use the 'improved clinch knot' when tying a swivel to the leader and when attaching a hook as it is easy and quite strong.

 

But the Palomar knot is really is a knot for line to hook (or swivel) not really a line to line.

 

But when I have joined spoiled Mono (30lb as a spool filler) onto 15 - 20lb Braid I use a Double Uni knot.

 

Here is a site that shows various knots that may help. http://www.netknots.com/fishing_knots

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Leaders, i find it funny sometimes that people run a fc leader that has little stretch on braid which also has zero stretch ?:shrugs: (i do run a fc leader thats lighter than my mainline on my bream gear) and the leader i run on my spin surf rods is 20lb fluro as well but thats mainly run for abrasion been in sandy shity conditions, 

Ps I run a long leader thats at least twice the length of the rod, for knots from braid to leader i use nothing but an fg knot 

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