Leader keeps tangling with feeder float when casting.

[doobie 5,802]

ok, how do I overcome this?

 

I'm using 6lb mono for main line in which a plastic feeder float is attached and slit shot either side > down to swivel > to a 6lb fluoro leader with a couple of split shots and size 12 long shank.

 

About 6 out of 10 overhead casts seem to tangle in the air. 

 

Float, being the heaviest, is leading the way and I can see the leader trailing behind and depending how the leader is trailing I can see 'oh that one tangled'.

 

I pull it in and yep, tangled.  I'm not doing anything different to the casts that do not tangle.

 

I also stop the line when the float is about to hit the water trying/allowing the leader to continue and straighten out - I'm sure most of would do this.

 

This is all mainly from rocks, so no choice but to cast overhead, although when on a jetty and I cast underarm, the same thing can happen when going for distance (although otherwise I just drop it a few metres out and let it drift).

 

But this is really frustrating me and wondering if anyone has any answer/advice to help prevent the problem.

[plankton 725]

When I've used a berley float I set the rig up so the float can slide between the hook and swivel, stopped by a split shot down near the hook. When you cast the float is near the hook so limited tangles, then when it lands in the water you give it a bit of slack line and the split shot sinks the hook and brings the float up to the swivel. Does that make sense?

[projoe 261]

just before the float/rig hits the water feather the line  with your index finger as it is coming off the spool.

[doobie 5,802]

When I've used a berley float I set the rig up so the float can slide between the hook and swivel, stopped by a split shot down near the hook. When you cast the float is near the hook so limited tangles, then when it lands in the water you give it a bit of slack line and the split shot sinks the hook and brings the float up to the swivel. Does that make sense?

 

 

Yep that makes sense.

 

But I wouldn't have thought the weight of the slit shot/hook/bait would be enough to drag the line through the float holes - but something I could try anyway and hopefully reduce so many tangles. on casts.

 

Thanks Plankton.

just before the float/rig hits the water feather the line  with your index finger as it is coming off the spool.

 

Yep, I do that projoe.

 

The tangling is happening when whilst float is in the air, so before it has hit the water the problem has already occurred.

[Rybak 622]

You can always put the feeder float at the end of the leader. The line to the hooks attached to the leader can be a little longer & can even put a small split shot on just above the hooks so the hooks are underwater to what ever depth you want. In the meantime the feeder float is still releasing berley on the surface. No more tangles. Alternatively use a spring with your berley mix squashed into it. You can also use this at the end of the leader as a weight to cast out.

[plankton 725]

Yep that makes sense.

 

But I wouldn't have thought the weight of the slit shot/hook/bait would be enough to drag the line through the float holes - but something I could try anyway and hopefully reduce so many tangles. on casts.

 

Thanks Plankton.

 

I've only used it on jetties, so it's a bit easier to let out some slack line and jiggle it a bit to get it sliding. With a berley float I only have my hook about 10cm below the surface anyway, so not much line to slide through.

 

Good luck

[doobie 5,802]

You can always put the feeder float at the end of the leader.

 

So you're meaning away from the traditional float setup to float right at the end of leader and hooks between float and main line.    main line > swivel > leader with hook(s) > float

 

Interesting, and I can see that working to stop tangles.

 

The only thing I'm thinking, is the main line swivel and hooks would create a bit of curve (sort of like a U shape but not as much) and wondering if that would cause any issues - though possibly not as the main line would be a little taut to the rod.

[Hobbo_510 70]

just before the float/rig hits the water feather the line  with your index finger as it is coming off the spool.

This is the tried and tested technique for the rig you're using. It will take some time to get use to it and how much tension to feather with. I might suggest get rid of the split shots or reduce the number needed, the bait flowing in the current is the proper presentation. The line Your mono "float side line" is too long or too thick. Maybe even try A shorter length of QUALITY heavier line then swivel. I use a 6lb fluro trace, 12-20!!LB for the float line, tiny clip style swivel( smallest I've got at the time ) . Hope it helps even pop a photo up if ya want.

[Hobbo_510 70]

 

You can always put the feeder float at the end of the leader.

 

So you're meaning away from the traditional float setup to float right at the end of leader and hooks between float and main line.    main line > swivel > leader with hook(s) > float

 

Interesting, and I can see that working to stop tangles.

 

The only thing I'm thinking, is the main line swivel and hooks would create a bit of curve (sort of like a U shape but not as much) and wondering if that would cause any issues - though possibly not as the main line would be a little taut to the rod.

 

Probably find the swivel after float is waving off to the side not inline??

[Seeseacol 381]

This is what I have been doing all my life, and my father who was a very skilled Garfisherman before me. If you can understand my explanation it will decrease your tangle problem greatly.

 

Basically the pencil float is held onto the mainline above the swivel with two bits of rubber tubing slid over line and float ends...this allows very simple trace adjustment by easily pulling line through the tubing ends. { Also allows for very quick and simple float changes }

 

IMPORTANT......The tubing needs to be of a size that it slips over the float ends leaving no, or very little float end protruding past the bit of tubing, If there is a bit of float protruding beyond tube it will act as another spot to snag your trace when casting, this will also be the case if you just use the line feed holes on a pencil float, the tubing eliminates the snagging component.

 

Trace below swivel about 90cm, but infinitely and simply adjustable to any depth the fish may be feeding at by pulling the line through tubing

 

IMPORTANT.....place a small spit shot about 200mm above bottom hook....this will add a little weight to the rig so when you cast and finger stop the line just as it hits the water surface the extra weight flicks the trace out quickly and in a straight line.

 

Give it a try, pictures attached may help explain. The tubing system is also 100% effective on all kinds of floats using different sizes of tubing to suit the float style

[doobie 5,802]

Thanks for your detailed info and drawing.

 

The drawing is how I have mine set up (except for the plastic tubing, but will get some and only 1 hook) and been using the feeder float shown at the bottom.

 

I have trouble with the leader wrapping around the float when it flies through the air, so will put the plastic tubing on anyway and see if it helps.

 

Also a couple of other suggestings from other above I'll try also and see which one performs the best for me.

 

Thanks all for your advice

[Cranky243 74]

Howdy mate.

 

I've always found using a mono leader of the same diameter as main line that's got more stiffness to it so trace tend to not fly around as much...added with the other suggestions from above will have you sorted.

 

When tying the loop on the trace for the hook trace to tie onto,I find tying a loop about 30mm long and then a blood knot onto that holds the hooks out about 2-3" from the trace and holds its form well off the main straight trace line when casting.

[Seeseacol 381]

Thanks for your detailed info and drawing.

 

The drawing is how I have mine set up (except for the plastic tubing, but will get some and only 1 hook) and been using the feeder float shown at the bottom.

 

I have trouble with the leader wrapping around the float when it flies through the air, so will put the plastic tubing on anyway and see if it helps.

 

Also a couple of other suggestings from other above I'll try also and see which one performs the best for me.

 

Thanks all for your advice

Just make sure the tubing sits tight and doesn't allow any part of the float to protrude beyond it.......the picture is only half right, the tubing in it is old and stretched, and the one on the left is not sitting correctly,...it has some float stem sticking out. the bit of tube on the right is a better example.

[doobie 5,802]

Thanks Colin.

 

I went to Bunning to get some clear tubing today.  Of course the tubing is a bit stiff and it will hug the inner stem of the float but at the pointy end it wont actually grip as the float tip narrows down.

 

I suppose tackle places would have the appropriate tubing.

[nosaj 121]

Clark rubber ?

[Hobbo_510 70]

This is what I have been doing all my life, and my father who was a very skilled Garfisherman before me. If you can understand my explanation it will decrease your tangle problem greatly.

 

Basically the pencil float is held onto the mainline above the swivel with two bits of rubber tubing slid over line and float ends...this allows very simple trace adjustment by easily pulling line through the tubing ends. { Also allows for very quick and simple float changes }

 

IMPORTANT......The tubing needs to be of a size that it slips over the float ends leaving no, or very little float end protruding past the bit of tubing, If there is a bit of float protruding beyond tube it will act as another spot to snag your trace when casting, this will also be the case if you just use the line feed holes on a pencil float, the tubing eliminates the snagging component.

 

Trace below swivel about 90cm, but infinitely and simply adjustable to any depth the fish may be feeding at by pulling the line through tubing

 

IMPORTANT.....place a small spit shot about 200mm above bottom hook....this will add a little weight to the rig so when you cast and finger stop the line just as it hits the water surface the extra weight flicks the trace out quickly and in a straight line.

 

Give it a try, pictures attached may help explain. The tubing system is also 100% effective on all kinds of floats using different sizes of tubing to suit the float style

Cracking idea, would save many tangles, definitely gonna try this out with most floats from now on.

[Seeseacol 381]

Thanks Colin.

 

I went to Bunning to get some clear tubing today.  Of course the tubing is a bit stiff and it will hug the inner stem of the float but at the pointy end it wont actually grip as the float tip narrows down.

 

I suppose tackle places would have the appropriate tubing.

Well I dont know about you but there is always a bit of tubing somewhere around my house, does not have to be clear, bit of old car fuel hose, garden irrigation tubing, bit of old electrical wire casing etc etc There is bound to be some tubing somewhere around the place, I never buy it deliberately, just scrounge something

 

Best to get tight fitting tubing, that way the line will stay put until you pull it through with a bit of force. Most floats will take 6mm/1/4 inch tube. For a berley float as pictures just that black tubing from garden micro spray set ups is perfect

[Seeseacol 381]

Actually this altered diagram may explain better...applies to feeder floats as well

[doobie 5,802]

 

Thanks Colin.

 

I went to Bunning to get some clear tubing today.  Of course the tubing is a bit stiff and it will hug the inner stem of the float but at the pointy end it wont actually grip as the float tip narrows down.

 

I suppose tackle places would have the appropriate tubing.

Well I dont know about you but there is always a bit of tubing somewhere around my house, does not have to be clear, bit of old car fuel hose, garden irrigation tubing, bit of old electrical wire casing etc etc There is bound to be some tubing somewhere around the place, I never buy it deliberately, just scrounge something

 

Best to get tight fitting tubing, that way the line will stay put until you pull it through with a bit of force. Most floats will take 6mm/1/4 inch tube. For a berley float as pictures just that black tubing from garden micro spray set ups is perfect

 

 

Of course, think outside the circle.  I do have some stuff lying around so will try those for a better fit.  Well done Colin, it's the wise wisdom coming out of you

[archerfish 685]

Spotlight is your friend....

 

http://www.spotlightstores.com/sewing/knitting-crochet/knitting-crochet-accessories/arbee-plastic-tubing/p/BP80121194001

 

Cheers

af

[Rybak 622]

As an alternative to using plastic tubing you can half hitch a pencil or feeder float to your line which can be adjusted up or down or simply remove if you want to fish without a float.

 

You make a loop in your line & put the loop thru the hole at one end of the float & then put the loop over the end of the float which locks it in. Do the same on the other end of the float. The float will then sit parallel with the line. To move the float up or down just reverse the process to one end of the float &  re half hitch to the new position. To remove the float altogether reverse the process to both ends. Easy as & no cutting lines etc.

[doobie 5,802]

As an alternative to using plastic tubing you can half hitch a pencil or feeder float to your line which can be adjusted up or down or simply remove if you want to fish without a float.

 

You make a loop in your line & put the loop thru the hole at one end of the float & then put the loop over the end of the float which locks it in. Do the same on the other end of the float. The float will then sit parallel with the line. To move the float up or down just reverse the process to one end of the float &  re half hitch to the new position. To remove the float altogether reverse the process to both ends. Easy as & no cutting lines etc.

 

Exactly how I attach my float rybak. A very simple way of attaching float and adjusting when needed.

[Brankim 945]

Yeah, split shots are the go! Not much else can solve that one, besides casting in an arc, and gradually applying pressure

[Brankim 945]

And sliding float with a stopper is a must!!

[doobie 5,802]

Well I have solved the tangling issue.

 

I put some plastic stoppers on each end of the float as suggested, but didn't think this would solve the issue as I already had split shots at each end anyway - sort of defeating the purpose but give it a go anyway.

 

Nope, didn't work or help much as still tangling through the air when casting - the odd cast was ok but many tangles.

 

Some also suggested to use a heavy leader, but reluctant as wanted to be light tackle although in theory I could see theory behind using a heavier line for the leader (basically it may keep it a little more taut and a way from the main line/float).

 

So this got me thinking to move the 2 slit shots I have on the leader down much closer to the hook - theory was to give a little more weight towards the bottom than midway up.

 

Solved - not another tangle was encountered for the dozen or so casts afterwards.

 

So thanks everyone for your help and suggestions and hopefully this post may help others.

[Seeseacol 381]

Further self explanatory diagram

 

Without tube ends there is higher possibility of the line snagging between float end and and float line hole, hence the trace may double over itself and instant tangle. Extra split shot nearer the bottom hook may also help as tried, but going light as possible is best using a very small split shot of 2mm or less

[doobie 5,802]

Thats a good diagram (like to know how you that).

 

The bottom one showing where the line can snag/tangle is definately the culprit.

 

The top one showing the tubing covering the ends of the float should definately reduce the problem in theory. I only say that because I found it didn't solve my tangling issue as I keept getting tangles on most casts with the tubing in place.

What was happening was the leader was now actually wrapping itself around the float (eg. not getting caught at the ends) whilst in the air.

 

What solved it, in conjuction with the tubing, was moving the split shots (I had 2), from around halfway along the leader down to very close to the hook.

 

Immediately, on every cast, I did not encounter a tangle again.

[Seeseacol 381]

I know you like to fish very light, and the lighter the better, but I still like to have my trace the same weight or slightly heavier than the main line which will also assist in less tangles/cross overs. The hooks attached to dropper loops on the main trace can be lighter though. The heavier and stiffer main trace line makes for more rigid dropper loops which helps keep the hooks away from the main trace line.

 

{ diagram examples are a simple thing with most photoshop programs, I use Adobe Elements an/or Adobe CS5 }

[Seeseacol 381]

Here's a very unorthodox Gar rig that works remarkably well when long casting for surface fish is the go.  This rig as odd as it seems was shown to me by some local fishos who fish the Seaford area from shore. Using this rig made such a difference to catching very little in this region to catching a good bag every time. I presume it may be just as effective anywhere else, but Seaford is where it originated.

 

The idea is simply attach a berley float by one hole only, why does it work so well ???....I think it's simply a case of the float tends to waggle a bit more in this configuration therefore releases a little more berley a little more often, The waggling float I presume also makes the bait { Gents } beneath jiggle a little more as well....but this is my theory, but whatever the reason it does work well at least for the  shy Seaford fish. I have never got a tangle from using this rig either even with very long shore casts.