How much rod tip 'flex' is considered good/bad/ok

[doobie 5,802]

As mentioned in another post, I am looking to get another rod for landbased YFW/Gar etc.

 

The rods I have do not have a really flexible tip but are probably medium flex tip and are 6ft.

 

I don't want anything expensive, and although at say $80+ is still too much for me.

 

I looked in Kmart and saw a Sports Fisher 2.4mtr/8ft combo for $30 (yes you can laugh now) and in BCF a Jarvis Walker Devil 2.4mtr/8ft combo $50 (reduced to $40) - yes laugh again.

 

But to me they seem they would do the job (of course they may not).

 

But what I noticed, when doing a trial cast, is that the tip flex was stiffer in the S/Fisher, whereas with the JW the tip was more 'wobbly' (hope that makes sense).

 

It gave me the impression with S/Fisher that when a cast is done, the rod tip would allow the line to go straighter (because of less 'wobble') whereas the JW with more 'wobble' would have the line going up and down until the rod tip balanced out (hope that makes sense too).

 

So what I am asking, regardless of brand, is a rod with more 'wobble' at the tip better than a rod with less 'wobble' at the tip for casting.

[AquaticResearch1 1,046]

As with alot of things in fishing it is dependant upon 1000001 variables.

 

A very "wobbly" rod, that is to say it is softer in the tip, will cast lighter weights such as those used for the species you've mentioned further than a "less wobbly", that is to say a stiffer tipped rod could. This is because the softer rod will "load up" with the weight, and use the loaded section to propel the bait/rig further.

 

However, a slow tapered rod, meaning the rod blank bends a long way down the blank,almost all the way to the grips, can be more of a liability than a help in casting and especially hook setting.

 

You see, in the lower end range of rods and fibre glass rods the softness extends throughout the blank. This leaves the angler with minimal punch or hook setting power, therefore they are hindered in their ability to sink the barb through flesh and they miss alot of bites.

 

The "perfect" rod would have a fast taper or Extra fast taper yet still have a sensitive tip. The sensitive tip allows the angler to cast light weights accurately and detect bites easily, while the fast taper allows the hook to be set far more easily. Unfortunately, the bulk of rods like this are made of Graphite, and the better rods tend to start from the $100 mark.

 

I tend to find if using monofilament a stiffer rod is required to compensate for the stretch, while braid can allow you to use a softer rod due to its lack of stretch.

 

So to answer your question. It depends on the situation. A wobbly tip would be better for casting in your situation (assuming you go with a glass rod, graphite generally regains its shape quickly) but the rod cant be slow and soft all the way through as you wont be able to set the hooks.

 

If I were in your situation I would look at the "Royale Gold" or something like that series in Kmart. The rods are cheap but they are light and they are far more crisp than similarly priced rods. This would probably be your best bet on a compromise between "wobbly" light weight casting rods and "stiff" hook setting/heavy weight casting rods.

 

An example; I have a Daiwa 6 peace travel which i picked up for $25 at the Boat Show one year. I can cast unweighted bread and light hard body's a mile with it. But i cant for the life of me set the hook into Redfin when they strike and when I strike a carp I've got to hit it like I'm striking at a bloody shark! Its a massive trade off and now i only use that rod when I want to have a bit of fun in the Murrays backwaters. Would i use such a soft rod for gar or YFW? HELL NO! I just wouldn't set a hook, I'd cast out to them but would never be able to hook them up over distance. I now much prefer relatively crisp graphite rods as the tip is sensitive and able to load and flick out light weights, but they have hook setting power unlike any glass rod I've ever used and are able to quickly turn the fishes head.

 

Honestly mate, if you get right into your fishing you'll want to upgrade in no time.

 

Hope that makes sense. AR1

[doobie 5,802]

Thanks AR1 for your detailed knowledge.

 

That certainly makes sense and has also educated myself further in all the extra details that help hooking a fish or not and/or the casting distance.

 

It might be best if I put some $ away for a while to get the better rod types.

 

But thanks for explaining the differences, I appreciate it

[AquaticResearch1 1,046]

No worries

[doobie 5,802]

What about this one?

 

http://www.bcf.com.au/online-store/products/Abu-Garcia-Discovery-Spin-Combos-7-3-3-6kg-2-Piece.aspx?pid=305949&menuFrom=30301#Recommendations

 

​It is  graphite and if it regains its shape quickly and has a sensitive tip - maybe it is ok.

[hooklinestinker 125]

The sky really is the limit when it comes to purchasing fishing gear doobie, as I and my bank account have already come to learn  (I only just discovered last week you can buy fly fishing rods that cost over a grand... crazy!!). In the space of about 2 years I have moved from a $25 Shakespeare rod bought at a Normanville service station, to around a $70 Shimano combo from BCF (plus extra for braid), and then onto my current rods, which all cost between $300 and $450 all told once you've spooled them up with good quality braid (Thanks @ Fishing Wholesalers!). In the right hands, the $25 Shakespeare could probably catch just as many fish as my current favourite, I just love the sensitivity and the quality feel I get out of the pricier components, the lighter weight, and I know that if I look after them they will last me a long time.

 

I guess my point is that once you understand what kind of rod you're looking for, be it a light setup for chasing gar, tommies mullet etc or a 14-foot Mullie-chaser with a 10000 reel, you buy the best you can get within your budget, and go from there. For me, I suddenly found a whole lot more disposable income about 5 months ago when I finally quit smoking... hopefully it will have paid for my kayak by Christmas too! 

[doobie 5,802]

Thanks UP.

 

(Firstly, that link above seems to have now been removed by BCF, but it was a Abu Garcia Discovery Spin Combos 7'3' Graphite)

 

As you say, I too will have to 'work' towards the higher end rods/reels, but at the moment I can't.

​

So I will need deal with what ​I have and can afford.

 

I keep mentioning to my​ wife the $ she could afford if she gives up smoking and what extra things she could buy for herself.

 

So I have mentioned you to her as another example   So good on you for giving it up and enjoy that Kayak when you get it - an excellent Christmas present for yourself.​

[hooklinestinker 125]

Thanks doobie! Quitting has been the best thing I've done in ages, my fitness has improved dramatically, I don't smell like an ashtray, and the aforementioned $$ benefits. I tried Champix (the medication) and patches and all the other things that didn't work, and it was e-cigarettes that finally did the job. Your wife would need to outlay about $150 to get all the bits and pieces to quit (I'm happy to tell you the kind of stuff you need if you like), and it lets you get off cigarettes while still having that familiar habitual element of having something to drag on, and blow out vapour instead of smoke.

 

Back to your fishing rods, for what it's worth, with that $25 Shakespeare rod I bought, I got a $8 spool of 8lb mono and re-spooled it from the even worse-quality line that it came with, and just cleaned and oiled it. I had 3 trips down to Rapid Bay and Second Valley 2 Summers ago with it and caught heaps of squid, tommies, gar and bastard toadies with it, and I had a great time, so don't stress about the kit just yet!

[doobie 5,802]

Cheers HLS.

I got the JW devil for the time being, so hopefully will do me well for the quality/price.

 

If you don't mind, can you pm the info on those bits - I'll 'carefully' bring it up at the right moment with her

 

Thanks for the info mate.

[AquaticResearch1 1,046]

Doobie, I was in an Hills Tackle shop yesterday and they had the 1-4kg and possibly more in the range Shimano Raider rods on sale for $60 or something ridiculous. It would be well worth it to start off with one of those rods. You'd be kicking yourself if you upgrade 3 months on and the rod costs you $120 odd.

 

Just a thought.

[Kuerschie 2,309]

There's plenty of good quality graphite rods that aren't too expensive in the right sort of specs that you're after. Look up the Wilson LCS range of rods, they're not too expensive. Or you can pick up cheap Shimano combos for around $59-79 depending where you go. We sell a lot of them to people who want a graphite combo that won't break the bank. You're probably looking for a 7fter, 2-4kg or lighter if you're going to chase yfw or just a general purpose combo for the beach, jetty, estuary, freshwater, etc.

Full graphite rods won't flex as much as their fibreglass equal and offer more sensitivity. Also they'll cast a lighter weight very well. If casting for yfw on most of the metro beaches you don't have to cast too far and you can also wade out a little if required.

[doobie 5,802]

Doobie, I was in an Hills Tackle shop yesterday

 

mmmm Interesting...can you let me know which place and what hills or pm me - thanks for the interest AR1 - appreciated.

 

There's plenty of good quality graphite rods that aren't too expensive in the right sort of specs that you're after. Look up the Wilson LCS range of rods, they're not too expensive. Or you can pick up cheap Shimano combos for around $59-79 depending where you go. We sell a lot of them to people who want a graphite combo that won't break the bank. You're probably looking for a 7fter, 2-4kg or lighter if you're going to chase yfw or just a general purpose combo for the beach, jetty, estuary, freshwater, etc.

Full graphite rods won't flex as much as their fibreglass equal and offer more sensitivity. Also they'll cast a lighter weight very well. If casting for yfw on most of the metro beaches you don't have to cast too far and you can also wade out a little if required.

Thanks also Kuerschie for your info - do you have/work in a tackle down South?

 

Something like this?

http://www.bcf.com.au/online-store/products/Shimano-Fishquest-2014-Estuary-Combo-7-.aspx?pid=360487&menuFrom=30301#Recommendations

​

[Kuerschie 2,309]

I work in a fishing and outdoor store in Richmond.

The fishquest combo is an alright combo but the tip is too whippy for what you are after. Here's one combo that's decent and will cover all round options.

http://m.bcf.com.au/Product/Daiwa-D-Shock-Spin-Combos-6-2-6kg-2-Piece/321032?isvariant=true

[doobie 5,802]

Thanks for the link Kuerschie.

Yeah, don't want to have one that is toooo whippy but needs to be sensitive - like the Raider as AR1 mentioned.

I'll have a look tomorrow as I need to go to BCF and swap over some fluro - picked 4lb instead of 6-8lb